Fixing WAR RvR Redux

As reported on the Warhammer Herald , open RvR XP is now double that of scenarios. This is after a previous boost last week of 50% which, in my excursions, still doesn’t seem to have dramatically increased open RvR (i.e. blasted people out of the scenarios). So continuing a trend of suggested improvements to open RvR, here are a few more I think would be helpful in addition to the many good ones floating around the blogosphere.

As I mentioned in my Five C’s post, and others in the commentariat have mentioned, scenarios are just so damned convenient. Queue anywhere, wait a bit, and you’re magically whisked away to the scenario and delivered back where you were when you’re done. Hard to beat. Maybe impossible.

Somewhere among the 20 or so blogs I surf almost daily, someone mentioned people still queuing for scenarios while engaged in open RvR and getting teleported out of battle into a scenario (!). Definitely a symptom…

The image of someone disappearing from a keep defense to go to a scenario struck home with me. It just seemed wrong. It seemed like it should actually be just the opposite (or at best, no worse or more inconvenient). This coupled with our own group’s frustration at looking and not finding any RvR got me procrastinating thinking… How to make open RvR as convenient as scenarios….


This has got to be the hands down biggest hurdle. When a scenario is “ready,” players that have expressed an interest in participating are given an option to be teleported from wherever they are straight to the scenario.

Lets even the playing field. Players that want to open RvR should also be able to “queue” for open RvR. A similar queue-like mechanism could be added– call it King’s Militia, or Guard Duty, or Defense of the Realm, or Goon Squad or whatever. When some kind of bona fide* attack occurs somewhere, the King sends out a call to arms– “Help! The Bug People are huffing and puffing and blowing my keep in! Mr Watson — Come here — I want to see you” etc.

If you have “signed up” for Defense of the Realm(tm) duty, then you get an oh-so-scenario like pop up that asks you if you want to answer the King’s call and go defend keep X in zone Y. Answer yes, and you’re whisked away to the warcamp nearest the battle. To keep things in balance, only a limited number of folks would be allowed to teleport in for defense. The rest would have to hoof it like now.

Yes, this makes taking a keep more difficult, but at least it fosters actual RvR and evens the playing field with scenarios on the geographical convenience angle.


Queuing and Teleporting works great for defense, but doesn’t help so much on O. Well, the increase XP given for killing other players unfortunately doesn’t really create any incentive to do it if there is no one there to fight. Providing a defensive scramble response would help ensure that there are some punching bags to hit when you do go on O.

Decide where you want to attack (or multiple coordinated attacks? oooh stategery) and poof, XP pinatas start zoning in.

Still that might not be enough to populate the RvR lakes. One problem is that once the BOs and keeps are taken, there’s no reason for the controlling side to set foot anywhere near the place unless there are other things to do in there that don’t require the enemy to be present.

Enter, the PvE Bait Quest. Something, anything, to do inside the RvR lake that would yield significant XP/Renown (over regular PvE) to attract [unwitting] players into the zone [to be squashed like bugs]. PQs in the RvR area as well as ordinary but enhanced PvE quests would at least create some traffic that might end up getting enough people in there that the light bulb might go on “hey, there’s two whole warbands of us whacking foozles, why don’t we go take that keep back…”

Again, not perfect, but anything that raises the chance that a critical mass might be present in an RvR lake would be a good thing.

Auto Warband

Communication and coordination is still a pain across groups, zones, etc. Step into an RvR lake and you should get dumped into a default warband just like a scenario. Everyone can see everyone else, you can see where they are in the zone. Of course, that whole zone boundary down the middle of the RvR lake issue is still a bit problematic (I mean, WTF, who made that fucking crosseyed hityourself in the nutsack design decision?).

If I’m solo or a small group, but as soon as I step into an RvR lake and see there are others already there, I’m much more likely to start something or participate in something.

Who knows, probably shouting in the wind, but the WAR bathwater is starting to get lukewarm, so unless things heat up, its getting close to the time to get out.


*bona fide, as in there has to be some kind of “real” attack going on. One dude plinking an NPC guard at a keep does not an attack make.

6 thoughts on “Fixing WAR RvR Redux”

  1. Great post. Some seriously good ideas there. A queue/teleport and auto warband mechanism would definitely help with organizing RvR battles. My only question is, wouldn’t you just be turning RvR into one big scenario? Either way, I hope someone from Mythic hears you, because I would love to see some of these ideas implemented. Nice work.

  2. The PQ (or some other repeatable PvE content) in an RvR area is indeed a great idea. Just place it near a Keep (but not close enough so they mix) and I’m sure it would increase traffic a bit. Giving the PQ slightly (one rank or so) higher rewards over similar chapter PQs would also help. The item you get is set, so you can’t just repeat farm the PQ, but since it offers a nicer reward, people might be more willing to hit up that one before the others.

    I still have faith in Mythic that they will solve the current scenario issue. I just hope they do it sooner rather than later.

  3. I’m sure someone knows this– how much XP (relative) do we get for killing the NPCs in a keep? My sense is little or none, but I haven’t paid too much attention really except that I noticed that after a keep attack last night which lasted quite a while and was only sparsely defended at first, I only got a small amount of XP if any.

    After an hour or so of on and off keep siege [attacking] (without much PC resistance), a guildie and I both noticed that our XP bars really hadn’t moved much.

    When we moved to a battlefield objective, the same story, except that when some destro defenders came to teach us a lesson, we started getting generous XP (i.e. on the order of 1200 XP or so for a Rank 20 kill by folks in their mid teens).

    If this is truly the case, this underscores my point about providing some other incentive to go on offense.

  4. @Crim: Yup. This starts to make RvR look more like scenarios (“if you can’t beat em, join em”), but with some major differences– the gamefield is huge, the “objectives” are wide and varied, there is no time limit, and the balance of power is dynamic and can tip back and forth as players come and go freely.

    We all know how unfun a scenario can be when you get THAT certain pug… At least with this, you’re not artificially constrained to a limited number of sucky players– you can have as many as you like :P

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